041: Ian Paget - From full-time to freedom as a logo geek
Award-winning designer opens up about going out on his own while supporting the community
Are you ready to leave your job as a corporate creative? My next guest tells all about his journey from full time to freedom as he did exactly that, and right before a global pandemic. We take a look at some of the ways you can make this a reality for yourself, on this episode of ärtful.
Ian Paget, owner of Logo Geek, is an award-winning Graphic Designer and Certified Brand Specialist, based in Manchester, UK with over 10 years’ professional experience. Logo Geek is a logo design service that specializes in creating unique & memorable logos & brand identities. Through Logo Geek he works with companies from start-ups to large corporate accounts. He also creates content, in the form of blogs and podcasts, for other designers to help them learn and improve their logo design skills. Ian has been on several international design award juries & has been featured in publications including Logo Lounge, Net Magazine, Photoshop Creative, AdWeek, Shutterstock & 99U.
NOTES
Ian talks about how he set himself up to successfully leave his job as a corporate creative to go full time with his business, Logo Geek, just after having a new baby (and a month before the outbreak of COVID-19)
We talk about the community and content he’s built over the years to support the designer community and we dive into his new offering that furthers his commitment to the Logo Geek community he’s developed
He opens up about how hosting a podcast, and leading hangouts and masterminds for the design community is helping him overcome his challenges with anxiety and public speaking
He also shares how his goals like overcoming his anxiety have helped him to continue to achieve bigger and bigger goals, like buying his first home and writing the book he’s currently working on
Ian shares the ONE thing you need to do to reach your goals
LINKS
Social media handle: @logogeek
TRANSCRIPT
[0:00] I was in a job for 11 years and I didn't realize how miserable I was in that job.
So just get rid of that job is like a weight off my shoulders. I'd already started planning Teoh cut costs and take things. And it'll be easier for some time.
Why did, as I saved up about five or six months salary. So if I got no work in would be would be safe for a few months. And you know, if I if I saw OK, this really isn't gonna work out.
I would have you know, that Buffer to go and look for a new job. So doing that kind of prepared me for this whole situation.
[0:36] Music.
[0:44] Welcome to artful community. Committed to championing artists and creative misfits from all walks of life.
Things show gives you an insiders look into the rial scrappy lives of artists creating with purpose including interviews with beat boxers, graffiti writers, DJs, chefs, photographers, designers, illustrators, filmmakers andmusic artists from around the globe.
A zwelling insights and inspiration mirrors truly I'm Gabriel if an award winning artist, coach, entrepreneur and fellow misfit.
All right, let's do this.
[1:16] Music.
[1:27] I want to tell you a little bit about today's guest, but first I want to read you the tweet that I read from Ian.
[1:36] That drove me to immediately d m him and ask him to be on this show.
This is the tweet He posted Day one last week.
After 11 years, I had my last day working in a Web design agency.
That role has been part time for around three years, but now I'm full in full time to focus on making logo. Geek would have always dreamed and imagined it would become. So let's get started.
[2:04] And then he did a cute little emoji with the the one with glasses and a photo of Iron Man taking off supercool tweet.
I immediately responded to him. I was like, Hey, man, I got have you on the show This is just super aligned with the type of life that I'm promoting on the show and the type of people out there living it, he said Yes, andthe rest is history.
So let me tell you a little bit about in Padgett.
He is the owner of Logo Geek. He's an award winning graphic designer and certified brand specialist based in Manchester, UK, with over 10 years professional experience.
[2:43] Logo geek is ah, logo design service that specializes in creating unique and memorable logos and brand identities Through logo Geek.
He works with companies from start ups to large corporate accounts.
He also creates content in the form blog's and podcasts for other designers to help them learn and improve their logo design skills.
It's been on several international design awards Juries and has been featured in publications including Logo Lounge, Net magazine, Photoshopped, Creative Adweek, Shutter Stock and 99 You.
In this episode, he talks about how he set himself up to successfully leave his job. Is a corporate creative to go full time with his business logo geek just after having a new baby and a month before the outbreak of Kobe19.
[3:29] We talk about the community and content he's built over the years to support the designer community, and we dive into his new offering that furthers his commitment to the logo get community he's developed.
He opens up about how hosting a podcast and leading hangouts and masterminds for the design community is helping him overcome his challenges with anxiety and public speaking.
He also shares how his goals like overcoming his anxiety, have helped him to continue to achieve bigger and bigger goals, like buying his first home and writing the book he's currently working on now.
And finally, he shares the one thing that you need to do to reach your goals.
If this speaks to you, then keep listening because we're about to get to it.
[4:12] In. Thank you so much for being on this show. Man. I'm so excited to have you here.
I'm really excited to be on. Thank you so much for inviting me. I can't wait to have a chat with you.
How you doing? I'm doing okay. How are you doing? That was actually my first question.
Yeah, Good. It's a bit strange for me because I I went full time about a week before the whole lot down thing.
So my life had already changed quite drastically prior to it. Say it's It doesn't feel massively different to normal that the only thing is, obviously we we don't go out as much as what we did.
I am fortunately quite busy with work and got the the little one as well, say, because I went full time at the same time, is this whole thing happened is it just feels like.
[5:00] I don't know how to describe it, really, I was in a job.
[5:05] For 11 years, and I didn't realize how miserable I was in that job.
So just get rid of that job is like a weight off my shoulders. I'd already started planning Teoh cut costs and take things. It would be easier for for some time.
Why did, as I saved up about five or six months salary. So if I got no work in would be would be safe for a few months. And, you know, if I if I saw OK, this really isn't gonna work out.
I would have you know, that Buffer to get a look for a new job. So doing that kind of prepared me for this whole situation.
[5:39] In terms like day today, I've got my work I need to do. We got the little one.
We've got films and games and I've got games consoles and and we've got subscription to every movie service, all that sort of stuff. So we got endless entertainment in the house, gotten a shortage of stuff to Dio.
Plus ah, is what she 11 now? 11 months?
Yeah, I love Mom. See how? Well So, uh, yes, He said the point off key thing quite badly.
So I normally put into beds my parent's bed about an hour ago.
[6:15] And, ah, if she wakes up it, we really hard to get back to speed.
But we have had a couple of evenings where it's just, like, wiped out the whole evening. And it has got to 2 a.m. By the time you first. So what? Her down. But she's walking while we're with support. She's walking.
So you've been walking around the garden and it has been lost Life so things.
And it's nice to be a home like I haven't missed any of that starts in sa One of the main things I I was hoping, hoping for my being a home.
So I would see all this stuff so great. So, yeah, to answer your question, I'm doing OK. I'm just trying to get used to like we had a completely different trajectory in mind. And then that got cut short Two months in.
And so now we're here, and you know, my wife Tiff left her hurt corporate job of 11 years at that.
Same is you, actually 11 years that hurt that company. You know, she's now kind of in this limbo.
[7:09] And so it's like, been challenging.
Yeah, and we both are in this mindset of like, Okay, we were, you know, we were that were about that we we love u K and Europe. And so we were really excited for that transition from Southeast Asia where we had notbeen yet, but we were loving it.
But we're, like, hot. It's so hot, we're ready to kind of shift and get to places that we really excited to go see, You know, then that just got shut down.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. It would have been nice at the moment as well, because we've had really good weather here.
So it's a shame when it's a shame inject like it's a fame here because we rarely get that much nice weather in the UK And, you know, ever since been locked out on every weekend being glorious way have a garden.
So I'm not gonna complain every night. I'd rather stay safe, you know?
[7:56] Yeah, my heart goes out to everyone because we're all dealing with stuff I didn't mastermind last week and they were, like, so cool. You're by the beach and like it is. But, you know, it's it's still locked down.
It is what it is. You know, we're still everybody's going through there.
Their struggles in one way or another is that we're supposed to be traveling, and that got cut short.
And so you know, everyone's got something going on.
Yeah, is globally as well. Looks I. I run a like I call it a local geek Plus, and we have these hangouts probably rebranded toe hangouts, actually, something that they're explains what it is.
But we just get on video calls every couple of weeks and chat. And, yeah, everyone's in the same boat, no matter what corner of the globe Blair on is.
Yes, it's It's odd having that unifying issue between us, you know, considering everyone is in such different places.
Yeah, everyone, everyone's struggling at the 1,000,000 or what I do know some people that are doing incredibly well, But you know, there's something that's happened.
It's just different. We just need to adjust to write and say I also wanted to ask, Are those hangouts you do? Are those public or this private.
[9:04] There was a private. There's a whole story to that, but I give you a short version.
When my partner was expecting when she was about eight months pregnant, she looked like she was going to give birth any moment. She was huge.
We was thinking that should probably have it quite early.
So I'm like, OK, so I need to prepare for paternity leave any time between now and a month and 1/2 say so I started slowing down my client work.
I mean, this is when I was part time, so I was still had a part time salary.
But obviously I didn't want to be working, you know, after becoming a father, say I slowed everything down. And then I had this month, and I like I should try and find a way of making a little bit of money.
I use mighty networks and zoom and combined all these things, and it doesn't make much money.
But I I I put out there that was creating this thing called leg plus the way t monetized the community that you have been doing that now that you know,
it's coming up to a year old and most like 90% of the members that joined at the beginning is still in its no expensive.
This is just $10 a month, so it's not like her big money maker. But I normally have the cause on like a Friday.
[10:17] So it's like hanging out with friends, and it just I just happened to be making a little bit of money from it.
Yeah, that's something I hope Teoh increase by.
I want to keep it relatively small, so I don't never really see as a money making thing.
But it's it's It's been great for me to get confident speaking and coaching and guiding people.
And because all this this type of thing is all new for me, I've never done it before, so it's it's allowed me to get a lot more confident, even speaking on video like am now just just feeling a lot more confident in myself.
So long time I might put the price up along the people that have signed the Valley.
They're locked into that price so hopefully they're stay in their long term.
Yeah, have it. How big is it? There was a small group that I let in for free at the beginning is like the Beat A group, and they have lifetime free access because I didn't want people pay for something that had nothing in it orno people in it.
So they let us more grief for people in. At the beginning, you were like the founding members.
[11:18] And there's about 20 also paid members.
So, as you can tell, it doesn't mean there there any pain, $10 a month. So it's only making, like, $200 month.
And then I need to pay for other things. That was, It's no, it's not really Aaron profitable thing until, really, But it's scalable now.
It's also allow the framework set up that that's just the result of what I am ended there, the beginning versus why actually have time to invest in it. And, ah, the most practical thing to work on is the hangouts.
[11:53] So it's just, you know, I all I need to do for that is look in the Times on, let people know and then come on the course.
So in terms of time, it's like sometimes the court was like two hours long. But that's my choice.
So maybe a maximum of five hours a month off my time, sometimes less.
Is that just you like people asking questions? The former is, um, it People know the calls goingto happen.
I typically create maybe a couple of topics as a backup plan, but generally, as people come in, it's just catching up and And when there's a group in, I'll go around the room and find out how each person doing.
And if they have a particular problem, then as a Greep, we're collectively help that person.
You know, it's This isn't about me. This is about the community.
This is This is a group of people coming together that are passionate about Lego design graphic design on.
So once they're going around the room, if there's something that comes up, obviously we'll talk about that.
[12:55] If not, I use my backup topic and just start discussing that as a as a group.
So like I said, it's very much about the community versus about me being like an authority or figure already that whatever you you'd want to call it, I I don't see it that way.
At the moment, I could probably do coaching, but I'd want the planet in structure it. This is purely like hangouts.
Just catching up with your friends if you got anywhere is you can talk about that. If you've got problems with the client you can talk about and we're solve as agreed.
That's pretty much what it is is that there was a point where I was experimenting with mastermind groups.
Say something I did at the beginning was create teams of full Andi, you'd come in and need each have, like, 15 minutes in the hotsy.
Yep. And you talk about that, but the thing without it took a lot more time for me. And, uh, that's why I didn't been No, I didn't been the idea by focused more on the hang out aspect of it because it was less time to do.
There was no planning. Well, I like I said, all I need to do is block out the time.
[13:59] Create the zoom link post our and if anyone wants to jump on the can.
And everyone knows when this is happening, because there's an icon events calendar in mighty network. So it is nice and simple.
And then after the call, I upload that Teoh YouTube within pasted in the group.
That's awesome, because I just started doing this something similar where I did a post out to social and said, Hey, guys, I understand everybody's really stressed and, you know, I know we're all going through a lot and Iwas like, Hey, if you want, I'm gonna offer free mastermind,
while we're in this locked down and then have, like, a charge version.
So you do you up? Because that was something I've actually been processing unlisted on YouTube.
Ah, okay, so you do like unlisted.
Okay, but you're not doing it on Facebook. Just unlisted on YouTube.
No, it's just unlisted on YouTube and then posted in the group for anyone want that wants to watch back. Or if there's anyone that missed it, they could watch it and then do you post?
Is the group in Facebook or is during the group is a mighty networks.
Oh, right, right. Yeah. So that that's like, um, I don't know if you ever seen It's a social media platform. I've heard of it.
I actually noted it cause I want to research it more. I've been kind of conflicted about doing groups and Facebook or going more away from social.
Yeah, I mean, then there's pros and cons of doing either one with something like Facebook.
[15:25] People are on those platforms already. People have a happy I have a habit anyway, of her.
Got my phone. That's one of the things I just check every day. You know, you just do out of habit.
And when the group is on Facebook, you scroll. You see the pace in your feet.
With something like 90 networks, you have to physically go to the domain sign in se.
One thing that's been really hard and the reason why I want rebranded Teoh hangouts is that the community aspect the form is quiet.
[16:03] There will be times when Mr No. One in their or someone pace and on the anyone getting back to that person, people dio people dip in and out. But it is.
It's one part, the whole thing that hasn't really worked. But what has work is the house.
Yeah, So I'm just gonna focus on that. Have one single message safe.
It simplifies it from a marketing perspective, because originally, I started putting training courses in there and all sorts of staff. Actually, if it's just one thing you need from a marketing promotional perspective, it's mucheasier. I'd say this is Hang out.
Come on line. Join me. Talk with your friends. That's it.
None of this has got This has got This has got this has got this. It just simplifies. And I think from a marketing perspective that makes it more.
Interesting to people because they know exactly what they're paying for.
And I think $10 toe hang out with other design. This is keep, I think, yeah.
I mean, if you're gonna pay 10 toe, watch Netflix and zone out, why not pay 10? Yeah, to grow and just hang out with friends on developers, a graphic designer, Um, and keeping it leg cost. There's no expectation.
So if they come one and don't they don't get any advice is it's like, Oh, yeah, just I have lost out with this and I think it's low enough that they just keep that subscription because it would just I heard I've done it with a gymmembership.
[17:25] You signed up for the gym, and then you don't go for six months and you're kind of slow at some point way. Although that would.
[17:35] This is fascinating. Thank you for going down this path, cause I This is something I've been playing around with, obviously, like I'm trying this new thing and people need to be accountable. Right? Then.
I think having a price forces them to not just let it slide and just keep being something they don't participate in but getting too high.
You're starting to create that barrier to entry for people that are already struggling, especially in a time like now.
Yeah, um, and not everybody is to your point, Like you said at the top of the show.
You know, people, some people are thriving and doing really well, but I really like where you're going with that cause that speaks to what I'm hearing is really important to you.
And what I've seen and we're going to get to this for sure, is how focused you are in the community and you're giving value and creating a space for community.
I don't mean you also need to bear in mind that I'm getting a lot of value from it, too, right?
Oh, yes, it's no all about the community's.
I'm obviously incurring a platform to support people and provide the assistance and and, I guess, companionship that that'll off solo practitioners need.
But it's been useful for me because I've always been very much of an inch of our.
The main reason why I started my podcast is because I suffered from an anxiety.
Andi, I mean doing a video call like this three or four years ago, right? No, I did. I would have just said no.
[19:02] Yeah, Why Don't really notice it now. But you know, there's most people face this.
They're just concerned about how they look, how they come across and stuff like that.
Say is it's allowing me to get comfortable on camera and to get used to consulting a group of, like, 10 people in coordinating them.
And, uh, there's a lot of skills that I think that you pick up from running, ah, group and, uh, let me not benefits like my I've always had, like, a long term vision.
[19:33] And these little things, even though we're not making any money from it, is building up skills to something that I would like to do a late today.
So, uh, I'm working on a series of books, a series of courses, and I probably turn these courses into some kind of life program of some kind would be a mixture of all of that content.
And I feel like you need to be a little bit of a showman for on these things.
[19:57] I don't want to be a shame em, but you know what I mean? Like you need toe, have the confidence to speak through and and communicate with a group and guide.
So it's building up the skills Teoh, that type of thing and, ah, also public speaking, You getting comfortable doing public speaking.
I I've got this goal to overcome my fear of anxiety or public speaking, and it's all building out to those skills and this these are monetary goals or anything like that.
It's just that I don't want to regret like when I'm 80 regret like, why didn't he do anything without a in you?
[20:32] We built this a lot. Why did you just hide behind Ah, a laptop and not try and build up these skills to become, you know, like my idols on.
A lot of my idols are people. He are a lot more public facing, and I think that's that's that's here a lot of people look up to, and I like to aim to be one of those people, not for monetary gain or anything like that.
But it's just more cause you only live once and I like to try doing that because I think it's worth having a goal that's beyond like a monetary thing. If that makes sense, yeah, that's something that I really connect with youon.
There was a big part of why I wanted to have you on the show is because I similarly had I found purpose.
And part of my purpose is to share your story,
and the word that you're doing helping designers and entrepreneurs and that's exactly aligned with, You know, what I'm trying to do is support you supporting others to.
[21:33] Provide this platform where you can speak to these things and people can hear what you're going through.
And you know, I love how open you are about your challenges with anxiety, you know, and that you're pushing yourself.
Yeah, and that you're pushing yourself in this way too.
Inch forward that little bit because you have that broader goal that you are working towards in this way that speaks to also your mission and your purpose.
Right with this low buried or entry hang out that people can get together.
It's supporting everyone, including yourself, and it's not.
[22:12] About you. It's about us. Yeah, that's very much the with the Facebook group.
And we mentioned that a few years back about a year after I saw that they they said,
I've never really seen as you have seen as the community and I said, That's what I've been aiming to do But you see platforms out there like the future and as a Christo thing.
Christo is the face of that, but would like a geek.
I would like a geek, even know why. I know I'm the facilitator of it'll, but the community is about the community.
Is no about me. I mean, obviously, I I do use the platform to help promote the podcast, but the podcast is there to help the community, so there is that side of it.
But in general it's, I don't want it to be about me. I wanted to be.
[23:01] Therefore, the community and the community is built. The community I haven't All I've done is created the platform and moderated and maintained and,
done everything I can to make sure it's a safe environment, the actual discussions and the way it's grown.
That's all being organic. And it's the community building that, not me.
And that's one. Another thing that I really connect with you on is is how you you're doing the work with logo geek.
[23:29] But then you're also doing the work with the community around logo geeky.
No word with the podcast on the blawg. And I mean, I read when I went back and looked I mean, you have,
It's over eight years of blogged posts you've been doing and I believe you just put out, I think the 75th Episode 75th episode. Yeah.
Yeah, so I mean, you're you're really working hard for a long time now, putting out all of this content and support for the community.
Plus, you've got these hangouts and things got minutes, just awesome.
Yeah, but I mean, I think it's worth mentioning that the podcast is sponsored content, So I am getting paid.
Teoh create that content in a way. I mean, I know it's not getting paid to create a but that's what it feels like having a sponsor, that the sponsor doesn't dictate the content.
They don't take. Take what I say, but I do have that obligation in that sense and then and it does generate an income. And I've always had this guess, marketing strategy, this content marketing strategy.
So I've always been really into S e A.
[24:36] So a lot of the blog's early on were just about creating relevant on page content, things like Twitter building up Twitter.
I noticed that when you share regularly, you become an authority around the topic.
[24:52] Andi. The building on the Facebook group is very much the same thing that because I am the facilitator and the lead off the indisposition me as the authority around logo design.
[25:06] I mean, it's still toe other logo designers is to other graphic designers, So it's no in the same way that is on Twitter by.
I have noticed that by being in that position, you do get these opportunities that come along.
So there is two sides to react mean, obviously the support in trying to give his bay genuine. But I d make money and I d make gain from it. So it's it's It's like running a business.
Why is running a business? But you're providing value at the same time?
I mean, that's loud and clear. I mean, when I look at your work, when I look at your website, your social media and your block posts and your podcast episodes, I mean you're mission driven.
Your also an expert.
I mean, you've been doing this for a long time now, so you're speaking to like like, a semi with logo geek.
The business e mean you're doing the work with companies day in and day out, so you're continuing to grow in that craft.
But then at the same time, you're sharing that with people and creating this space for them to support each other.
And to be a part of the conversation, as opposed to just speaking at them has been interesting with the podcast because originally, like Season One, I focused on like I wanted to speak to my hair ease.
[26:23] So there was that there was a lot off people I reached out to see, the one that I really wanted to speak, Teoh.
And and that was, you know, like, an amazing opportunity. But then I realized, after doing sees that one, I saw a lot of value in it for me, for the community, like there was so much, so many benefits to doing the podcast.
Season one. I actually only have a plan to the one season just I just said that so that you're aware, but it helped me grow in confidence.
It it was great speaking to my heroes, I was learning from them on you chair out and then you get all this amazing feedback from people.
It felt like a really good thing to do, even though I was, it was generating an income via sponsorship.
Yes, it's been so nice toe be able Teoh, interview my heroes or interview people that are maybe in 10 20 years ahead of me and pick their brain, but.
[27:14] Also share those conversations with other people so that they get that same benefit. And even though it unlike 75 episodes now, I've got, like, five or six more recorded. So I've done over 80 episodes.
I've learned so much like I had a conversation earlier, and this is for, like, Episode 80 and I learned something new, and I mean, bear in mind. This is a podcast about logo design.
It's one the single topic and is crazy thing. After reading so many books that you see on all these books here a lot of them about a lot of them about our about branding and logo design, and I've read most of them.
It's amazing to think, even after like, well, nearly 100 conversations with graphic designers that I'm still picking out new stuff.
So yes, beneficial to me in that sense. But I am having those conversations primarily now for,
the community, and in trying to want questions I name will come up and, like, if I ever realized that someone needs some support in some way, I will try and create a piece of content around that, and.
[28:12] They just build up this library of support.
So it's something I started doing recently so that I can get really deep on the topic myself.
I've started doing so, you know, episodes we're just taking a little bit of time to get comfortable with. So I've done a couple of solar episodes now.
It means that a lot of the stuff I've been trying to get out, I guess that I know that I haven't been able to get out. I've been able to do that myself and just go really deep on the topic.
[28:38] But, I mean, I'm gonna repurpose that content. So a lot of that when I do a solo upside is all contributing to like a book.
If I've got a plan for a buck up appear on my board and I've got all the chapters down and when I'm thinking of ah, podcast topic, I go through that and what I can do is by planning out the episode.
It's a rough draft off a chapter of the book.
So been trying with everything I'm doing to build up something bigger long term.
I love it. I love it, man. Very, very similar trajectory with you of creating these goals that are personal and you know, like your growth with around anxiety, right?
And I want to speak back to that because that's something that I think is just so powerful for the audience to understand and appreciate because, you know, we're constantly dealing with so much as creatives and is a muchentrepreneurs.
But to continue to put that needle, it's a little bit further, but then have that really distant goal of like, I want to have a book.
I want to speak in front of people, live and set those bars accordingly, to then have thes things that you're doing each week working towards that goal.
I just I love seeing that vision that you have.
[29:56] If the future version of yourself I think that's one of the most important things toe have.
I learned that from a book. The one thing.
And I also saw a talk a few years back. It was it was from a guy who I remember exactly what the story was, but I think it went something. Like I told his sister is gonna meet out on John one day.
And she said, Now, you know, and just out of spite, he made his goal.
Teoh, basically meat now out on John so that you could pick up the phone and get out and John to speak to on the on. He came like a producer and everything. And he built this whole goal where he came.
He became this massive producer, and he ended up being there on stage, without John and around the backs. Like, can you just say hi to my sister?
Oh, well, he reversed engineered this entire goal, and I wish I recall what the guy's name was.
But that story is always stuck with me, sir, if you got this like some world, their goal, you can make long term choices like this. Could be personal and professional.
[31:03] Say there was a point a few years back where I want to get on the property ladder and own a house at some point in my life. Yes, I live just outside of London.
Where was living. It would be impossible for me to ever get on the property ladder unless I like, trip with my income in some way because the house is down there just ridiculous.
And I mean, even if I was to get a mortgage would be absolutely stretching every penny.
And I would never be able to go on any holidays or anything like that.
But I I wanted to find a house, and I wanted to be able to afford to get on holidays when it came to it actually relocated and moved up north. And the properties up here are like 1/3 of the price or half the price, as they aretoe outside of London.
So I moved out here, bought houses, a three bed house as a big back garden, and my actual monthly living costs.
[31:54] Haft Well, not quite half did not that drastic, but it was a song significantly less so.
That meant I had more money that I could save, which could then be invested in holidays and of the stuff like that.
I mean, it's slightly different now because I my partner, doesn't work.
We got that little one. But it's created a a lifestyle that's affordable, and I'm ableto have what I was aiming toe have with those goals.
So, like I said a few years ago, dreamt of Emory coming, having a house or only house and now got that.
I mean, that was a big choice to make, but it was all it'll worked back to those long term goals.
So you could you could make choices, say, like the paid membership group, even though it doesn't make any income now with the benefits that,
it has, its building up those skills and is building up a framework that contributes to my long term goals. And it's not really about.
[32:51] The money. It's just that the income that it makes supports supports it. So I can that I am able to do that.
That's awesome, something that's really become really important to me in the way I look at my life is around. How much, what is enough?
What is enough for me? What is it that I want in my life? What is that? I see myself what's important to me.
It's actually ironic. We're living it now since our trip got postponed, the three goals my wife and I came up with We want to put money away for our retirement.
That's something that's important us. The second thing is that we want to travel because we love travel.
We love seeing the world. We love engaging in other cultures, learning about cultures and meeting new people.
And the third thing is to live on the coast and we were just traveling and we had put away to go do that and so this the and just kind of figuring out how to do that.
But then we're also here in a place in Mexico that's cheaper,
and it's it's a it allows us to be able to do this while we're in the midst of what's going on and to be able to live similarly live that lifestyle that we want to live and to to actually facilitate.
[34:09] The kind of life we want and by knowing what is enough, like what we want.
[34:14] Yeah, there's, Ah, story that I heard off or I read, Ah, a few years back.
I think it was tiny. Robbins that mentioned it were recommended it and I read it. It was about a fisherman.
I know this story, Yeah, yes. So it went something like, There's a guy fishing on the coast just being there in this boat, enjoying catching fish.
And you get a businessman that comes over to him and says, Why didn't you get a bigger net? And then you can catch more fish and the fishermen gays. Why?
[34:45] And it's like so that you can earn more money and buy a better boat, and it's like why.
[34:50] So that you can catch you from, or fish and and go out into the deeper see or something like that and be able to catch even bigger. Better fish Andi again, he asked Why and the long story sure is.
I ended up getting around to so that you can be rich and and healthy and enjoy life and so that you can basically spend your time fishing on a boat on the sea.
[35:16] And it doesn't leave background, but the story But the General just is that money is just a means to have the things and is one of these things.
I I put a lot of thought into this life if I did some the winners a huge amount of money.
Yeah, okay, I'm probably live in a nice house in a nice a place and get a nice car and maybe go on a few more holidays.
But once I've gone beyond that, I would probably spend my time doing what I'm doing now, which is working on a gaze, building this community, creating training courses, creating material for other logo designers.
It's being my dream and gold toe build all of these things and It's what I'm doing now on DA Yeah, I mean, we I've got a the house I wanted.
Okay, It's like 95% of it is owned by a bank, but it doesn't matter in money is it doesn't really exist.
The only difference. It makes us that everybody agrees.
Everyone collectively agrees that you are in that thing.
[36:20] Money is like in reality, just paper, and it's not really there.
It's like from a psychological point of view, it's just that we all collectively agree that that person owns that thing.
That person doesn't really Oh, nothing. You know, once you've gone from this world, you know, when she passed away, it's still that, like it, just someone else someone else takes.
It was, hopefully that makes sense. What I'm trying to guys, there's more to life than than money, and it's worth thinking about what you would really want and what you would spend your time doing.
Once you've gone beyond that point of going on big holidays and owning stuff, and you can actually do a lot off that without being a millionaire.
If you want to travel the world, there's ah but called the four hour work week. I think it's called.
Tim Forgets him. Faris. Yeah, Tim Ferriss basically says, actually works out cheaper.
Two GOP to places like Asia, like the the actual living costs of traveling around Asia and seeing where these places is less than your monthly mortgage or rent in the UK Yep, eso.
If you really, really wanted to do these things, you can actually do them now. You either save out of the money, which I know is easier said that done or year Krayem.
[37:41] A company for yourself so that you can work from a laptop so you can travel and work at the same time, which is pretty much south. Like, that's time for thing that you was planning to do. Yeah.
And that lifestyle isn't that expensive. You just need to plan carefully. And if you really want to do that, you can.
Yeah. That's exactly what I was speaking to. Is that? I mean, it was like, What is enough? What is it that we really crave?
And how do we create that space?
We we went through and got rid of stuff and got clear about what we really wanted to keep.
We sold a bunch of stuff. We put that money into our fund for our trip, and we started planning.
We set a date, we figured out where we wanted to go. And yeah, Southeast Asia is cheap.
I mean, we were spending together about 100 bucks a day.
[38:34] Yeah, on. And that was including lodging. That was including food that was including any We didn't really shop.
But if there was any kind of shopping, like how cheap taxis.
[38:46] Oh, yeah. I mean, it's they were under.
Sometimes they were actually change like they were under.
At least you know, they're there like thousands of rupees. But it ends up being something like, you know, 75 cents or, you know, a dollar or something to get so many kilometers away.
Yeah, and you're just going What?
When you actually step back and think about it. You're like, Wait, how much is it? How much is a taxi in London?
Waste. That's equivalent would be, like 30 £40 in the in the UK around. But you know that same distance in places like Bangkok, you could do that.
This that distance from £5 it's a fraction of the cost. Say yeah.
So no, as out of reach is what a lot of people think.
If you really want something, I think that's what you need to work out.
You need to work out what you really want. And in most cases, a lot of people are in a position where they can actually do that without trying to become some millionaire.
Yeah, I mean, that's the thing, right? Like a lot of people are looking for some Golden Nugget, and they,
I think that if they get to this point financially, or if they hit that this goal or that goal, if they have this thing or that thing,
that it's going to solve it and it doesn't it just ends up moving the goalpost a little bit further and down this path of things as opposed to.
[40:13] You know, experiences and the goals that are really important.
Like you said, you can't take it with you. I wanted to speak to that. Actually, with your the way that you've established your life now going You know this journey from full time to freedom.
What led you to leaving?
You know the gig at the Web design agency after I mean 11 years and then going all in with logo geek.
I've been working at this agency for about 11 years.
[40:44] Andi, on the side off my job.
Start my entire career news Ever since school in college, I've always worked on some kind of a side project just for fun, Say, at the beginning of my career, this was things like,
album covers and and logos for banned from my space.
I just did it for free, you know, just for fun.
I didn't know what I was doing, so it was a way of, like, practicing and improving.
There was a point where something I started doing, I found this like local club.
I got in tricks. I went to this film class like this class to learn how to make sure movies and write scripts and stuff like that, which was like a fun thing to do on this course.
I met these animator's they were animators at the time, and we were into the same things, you know, like Star Wars and films and all this sort of stuff, so I would go there and help with these workshops fitted theseworkshops where kids called Media Circus.
Anything that these guys these kids want to do, whether it's make films or make gains, stuff like that, we the to owners or the two animators they would they would run this thing that was funded by the local council.
I went there as a volunteer, and I would I would kind of help the kids with certain projects. And, you know, being a graphic designer and being inter like films and stuff like that. I was able to rest the help, and they hadquestions provide that support.
[42:09] But the animators there, uh, they actually started to make iPhone games, and this was early on.
You know, when the building an iPhone game was a way of making lots of money, say things like angry birds that made millions on DA.
They obviously wanted to get in on this thing. So.
[42:29] With those guys. They started building out, and I like If you ever need any help with any of this, I'd be happy toe come in And in the end, I a help with some backgrounds for some games.
And then they were so happy with, like the background artwork and graphics. I did it.
It helped him kind of take the game up to that next level.
And they said he and if you ever got any ideas for any games or any app, so anything like that, just give us a show.
I took the AZA an open indoor, so I pitched this idea for this game.
They love their and they accept it, accept it and obviously none of us was getting paid. This was just a fun project to work on. So I did all the graphic design for the game or the animation sheets or the menus graphicsbackgrounds.
I took it as kind of like a really fun project. So I got into this habit off going to work, coming home, working on this project.
It was on and off for almost four years because at the beginning we we designed a prototype.
We pitched it to chilling Gay, which was owned by EA Games.
They loved the idea, but they said it needed to be Brian colorful, say, I mean, this was like a year or two in That meant a whole redesign. So none of us was making any money from this. It wasn't our full time thing. Thatwas just on and off a over a long period of time.
[43:46] And then we finished the game. Andi, I was pretty exhausted from during this game, and I have decided,
Okay, No more big projects are just focus on my work and I won't take on any big products like this because it was just I loved it.
And it was an incredible project and an amazing experience, and I still I really love the way that I did back then. But yeah, it was exhausting to give it a few weeks.
[44:15] I was like, I really want a project. Work off on Bond, my partner at the time. This was nearly 10 years ago.
Now it's quite some time ago. She she said to me and you really good at logo design and I had done that much Up until then. I bought in a little bit, so I did a little bit in my full time job.
There was a Web design agency said there was the occasional project that required a logo, and I have done a couple of logo design projects. A for those games I mentioned. I did the Legos and branding and everything forit, and I thought, Yeah, and I'd quite like tea.
Focus on that. Yes, I set up. I wanted a website, a platform where I could work on projects for friends.
And I was always into comic car and I still am. And I thought, Yeah, I could go to comic con and like, get around comic con and say kind of help with your branding, and I'd love to do that, Say I I write down all thesedifferent domains.
None of them was available, but eventually I found leg a geek dot k dot UK Andi.
I wasn't quite sure if it was right, but I registered it anyway because I thought it was a good day. Maine and I stopped this website on the side of a full time job. It was always just a hobby.
So I do the occasional lay ago for a friend.
[45:33] I stick on on the website if I felt like writing something like if I wanted to learn a little bit more about,
branding to contribute to my main day job like that's the way I sort of like I want to learn a little bit more so that I could be really good in my day job.
[45:49] So I'd I'd right, I did it on their by accident.
Without planning this, it went from doing self initiated projects to someone I used to work with, asking me for something and then, you know, like a old friend from school would ask me to do something.
And then one day out of the blue, someone I didn't know got in touch.
[46:12] You know, they found my website, that with us, I mean, that website was bad.
That was for me, just for fun. So it grow and I mean fast forwards in that would have been like, six or seven years ago.
It grew from being just one or two projects Teoh lots and lots of emails, lots of lots of messages, lots of lots.
Of course, it was just exponentially growing like the mori did. The Maura grew because I was posting on social media in the same time.
And ah, yeah, the social media was growing. Everything that's growing.
Yeah, I got to this point where on there was just too much and I went through this struggle for years. I was driving everyone nuts around me, but I felt like I needed to choose between the two.
My main focus was my main day job. That's why I wanted to do.
I just wanted toe work for Web design agency, maybe going work for brand the agency and work my way up in the graphic design world and maybe one day work for one of these big agencies but couldn't give up the logogeek thing.
[47:17] So I decided this is too much. I can't cope. But I couldn't let it go like the any way to stop the emails and to stop the messages and stuff like that would be to remove the website off the Internet.
I like now It's been too long, and I know I'm not taking it down. So I was in this place for years and then my life got a bit rubbish.
If my my mum diets, she had Fastenal adventure.
[47:42] And so I watched their Slaley kind of fade away.
Andi at the same time, wave split with my partner. So it wasn't It wasn't a good time that it was being in the home with my mom, meaning she was in a home.
Onda, you see all these older people at the end of their life and it really got me thinking What if I regret not doing that thing for time?
It really, really like trained that home and ah, I don't know what it was in near that point.
If I thought Fuck it, I'm just gonna focus on this. I got lows. Leads coming in this way. Enjoy. This is what I want to do.
A good point, Pifer and and change and do something new. I can focus all my time and energy on this.
Andi, if it goes wrong, it doesn't matter. You know, I are. See what happens. At least I won't regret it.
I think I read. It was in Tim Ferris's book, The Four Hour Work Week, which I read about the same time where he tries thes days.
Or he he does this thought exercise where he imagines, what would you do if you lost everything?
[48:53] And I can't remember what he calls in this book. But yes, like these some days, all these, like, you know, days where he does imagine what it would be like if you did lose everything.
And I went through that thought exercise and I'm like, OK, if I lost all my money and I lost everything and I couldn't pay from mortgage,
I'll get around my sister's house, knock on the door and be like I sleep when you're safer, and then I'll get another job and then on to start again.
And actually, that's not that bad.
[49:21] Why did that day? I'm like, I'm gonna hand in my notice, wrote up the letter, going to wear, send it to my manager's.
Onda obviously got called into the office, and I've been with the company for a long time.
I became like the creative director for the company. They put me on the board of directors, so they were really bummed out that I wanted to leave.
I become part of the furniture, so I spoke to them about that.
I said, you know, a really good point to start something new. And about two minutes into the meeting, My boss just asked me, Would you be able to part time it? I just started thinking, Yes, that would give me a little bit ofextra time.
Give me security means I still have a guaranteed income by can.
[50:08] I could get used to working for myself, and I can transition my way out.
So I thought by for a couple of minutes and I said, Yeah, be open to that.
[50:18] Say we We agreed the terms and stuff like that, so I would work there three days a week, and then the rest of the time, I had worked myself.
So that was kind of phase one of leaving. That was about three years ago on dumb.
That's when I actually relocated as well, because they had an office up north just outside of Manchester.
[50:41] Eso I relocated up north on de So ual that change was my main focus.
You know, having a part time job kept the money coming in, and I could meave on die turned one of the as a three bed house and one of the rooms is guys that person office?
Yeah, just that kind of got me used to area. I was able to get my my life kind of back together, you know? Got house started meeting people here.
My partner. We've now got a little one, but you're just sorting out kind of my life. My life became my main focus rather than like there was that kind of that whole period where I was just going to that part time job.
It felt easier. Just got on with the job. The left material. Yeah, I wasn't really thinking too much about what I was.
Yeah, just fakes. And on that I plod on with my things at home.
That's about the same time I started the podcast, which I got a sponsorship for it say, and that was great and create the content. But it was about three months ago that I decided it was at the start of the year.
I don't know what it was about that day, but I went into my partner said, Think of my hand in my notice, Yeah, I think I think the thing that really.
[51:55] Drove it home is I've been doing a lot off the fill it based marketing,
leading up to going on paternity leave made like over £1000 a month from affiliate marketing alone without doing any client work as getting sponsorship money from my podcast and stuff like that.
And there were times when I'd be sat work doing stuff I didn't really want to work on, and I made more money from my fill it stuff.
And then I worked out just how much I actually made a day. And I'm like, Why am I doing this This for such a small amount of money?
I mean, it's meaningful, mounts up. You know, when you when you add in the days together, it doesn't mount up and it's It's no massively different to work for myself but are assisting King. Can I make that much moneyworking for myself?
And I just worked out, and it's like all I need to replace three days worth of income from a part time job was one project a week or no.
Even that maybe like 1/3 of a project a week to cover that same income Prior Teoh this virus situation.
I was having three good cause a day.
[53:06] And yes, I cane, all of them would go ahead. But quite a few of them would say maybe one or two of these schools would be interested in proceeding with the project.
Yeah, I just thought, you know, if I work really hard and really focus on this, I can make this work. And I could be completely self independent.
So that was the main reason why I You know, I I think it's important to know those steps. It's no easy Teoh.
[53:35] Jump ship. In my case, I've had it in my head that you need a job and that you need that.
And that job is a 9 to 5 and you go to this place and that's how you make money.
So you working for myself isn't totally different mindset.
And, ah, it's the mindset shift and there's it's scary a month in my notice, period I had to do in two month notice, period a month in.
I felt really sick some mornings because I'm like, Can I do that? It's going to really do this, But yeah, I've been doing I've been four time now for a month, and it's it's been really good.
[54:13] Yeah, that's another thing that I connect with you on this I was the same way. I was a corporate creative.
As I was developing the concept for the artful, I was stepping back and realising like that really was.
The North Star of this mission was to help people draw their life and not trace it. And I was thinking about like how important that really is when you think about what to draw is versus to trace.
Yeah, and when you're tracing someone else's life. And that's what we were doing is corporate creatives. You know, we were tracing a life we thought was how we were supposed to live, you know, ended Teoh Safety,security.
[54:51] And you just perfectly explained how you deconstructed that and created this whole life for yourself in several ways.
I mean, you talked about working for yourself, also being having this mission where you're supporting the community you tuff talked about, you know, wanting to own a house,
and invest in that for your future with your family, that is now growing.
Hair has grown, and you're you're living that example.
And yeah, that is exactly why I wanted to bring you on and speak on the show is because I saw your post and I instantly knew e mail him right now.
Gm him and Twitter get him on the show because I just was so proud to read that comment of I'm pulling the trigger.
I'm going for it full time. I'm all in logo geek.
This is what I'm doing. And that was that, you know?
And so it's just so exciting to hear that story in its entirety of like, how you got to that place and then gave yourself that permission to go for it and do it and then you're still doing.
You're still doing really well.
[56:09] Even our global.
[56:13] Which is again why I was like, this is this will be so great to have you on the show. Now, even in a pandemic, you can set up the.
[56:24] Elements of your life to be able to successfully transition, to be in this kind of space where you can thrive.
Yeah, I mean something I think is really important. Teoh Get across is it's easy to look at.
[56:42] Why built now It's like my website.
The body of work got decent email list to get a decent social media following a big community, and I'm generating income from dinner, you know, generating a tree, passive income.
But that doesn't all happen right away. It's being very small, incremental. That's over the years.
Say, you said, I've been I've been blocking now for probably about 89 years.
It wasn't a serious thing in the beginning. It was just whenever I felt like it.
So you know me. Maybe when I was bored over a weekend or when I was on a holiday and I just felt like just doing something distinctly in my mind, I'd write something it There was no plan. There was no stroke to tourit.
Things like building up the social media following that, being literally 10 minutes here, 10 minutes there is not being properly like or strategically planned out on carefully structured.
It's all slowly taken shape and things have changed. In a way. I see the future of it has been adapting.
You think like the podcast that didn't exist in the beginning? I didn't even know that I was gonna be doing that. I didn't know that there would be a Facebook community that would be thriving. Now that was never part ofthe plan. All I wanted to do is just work on the occasional logo design project from fine.
[58:05] So you need to understand when you're building up your own thing, just do a little bit every day.
And I've always like to describe it like, Imagine doing 10 minutes on something every single day,
after one week, you would spend one hour, 10 minutes on that thing and then if you kept doing that every day for an entire year, I don't know what the masses, but just 10 minutes, you know, just doing a little bit when youwork for a company,
these things just kind of just blend in with everything else and you don't really see your contributions.
I mean, you do, but it doesn't feel the same. But when you write us except you're building website and you want to write a 10,000 word block.
That's really daunting. But just if you just did 10 minutes a day after 23 weeks, you would have that Blawg and the block will be there forever, and it be on your website and it will always be there.
And you can point people towards that. And I guess what I'm getting at and they matter what you want to build.
Providing your end goal is very clear.
[59:09] Every small, incremental thing that you do reaches that goal, and I like the idea of their for climbing a mountain.
[59:18] Andi, if if every single day you did one step all in a straight line, you had events to get to the tops.
But what a lot of people do. They see this shiny coin on the right or this like really cool thing over there.
What makes people do that? Stop there. And I look over then and walk in that direction while they walk in that direction.
Or maybe they walked back over there excessively, something call and shiny in that direction.
[59:44] Some lead, like a with these tiny steps, they're not leading in the right direction.
That that's why you need to have that really clear, like north. How that goal so that these small steps that the small things that you do this small, tiny accents that seem so say, my new and so pointless on their own.
But they will contribute to this greater thing. And that's why I really noticed would like a geek.
I mean, now I got this, like, massive community, but when I think just one person a day, it's just it builds up.
Its thesis ties the tiny accents every single day that contribute to something, and people forget that just inching at little bit forward to the top of the mountain that come on, let's be clear. It never We never get to the top.
You never get that. Why? I don't think it's good to get there because I mean to give an example. One of my original goals was to become a famous designer like my idols.
People like Jacob, CASS and David very. You know, the type of people that would be in magazines being books, and you just know them for that topic.
And that was one of the early goals. And one day I just,
got in a book and got in a magazine, and this is know as callers where you think it's Ah,
it's very short lasting in excitement in the joint because the book comes and you're like, Yeah, this is cool.
[1:01:09] And then you feel your friends and family.
You take a picture and maybe book. About a few days later, that book is on your on yourself, new just carrying on.
And that's the reality of these things tryingto chase fame or whatever.
I mean, I am technically at that point, but it's not what you think it's going to be because your life is just exactly the same as what it was.
There's no Yes, Okay, you're famous online and war whatever like that.
But you know, people aren't like sharing your name or things.
I don't know why I was expecting, but that it's not what you imagine it would be s.
So I think it's better toe have a goal that so, so high up that mountain and so far away. And you keep shifting and changing it so that you never do reach it because I come from what book it is.
I think it was another by Tony Robbins. But the enjoyment is the journey, not the final destination, that that's what you need to be really focusing on the actual day today because that's the reality of it.
That's, you know, the journey and that there should be these nice moments when you work towards something but.
[1:02:16] Things like my goal off being, Ah, I'd love to be a good public speaker one day because it's always been way out. Fleet.
Worse fear doing public speaking, I've always absolutely hated. It's being horrendous.
Any time I wanted to do public speaking, but just having the goal of maybe doing a tech talk one day, you could do one tech talk, but you can keep doing them. You can do loads and you can just keep working up and youcan choose.
Just keep developing that skill. This it's not really a final destination. There's a lot more to that one thing that you could do. And, uh, like I said that that end goal it should be.
You shouldn't be able to region. There's a really good analogy.
I don't aim for the moon, aim for the stars and you'll reach the moon in the process. Something like that. That's a saying like that. And I think that's true with goal setting, that they should be so big because you don't everwant to reach that.
What is the number one thing that you'd like listeners to take away from this interview?
Probably the most important thing is all those small steps towards one clear goal and please walking towards that end goal and then you will reach.
People talk about coming up with all these strategies and all these plans and all these crazy things, but you achieve something by doing it.
There's no magic tricks to anything like that. If you want to achieve something, you just work out what that thing is and you just keep working towards that and just sitting down and working towards up.
[1:03:44] Actively until you've got what you wanted and that's it.
That's that's how you become successful. You just keep working at walking in the same direction and no getting distracted by shiny pennies and you know things around you that take you away from reaching your dreams.
All right. Now get some fun questions for you. Yeah, sure.
[1:04:07] What is your favorite movie or documentary and pass trucks back, Brother, What about books?
What's the book or books that you've given the most is a gift? Or that you just love that you give back to keeping on topic The ONE Thing that was important. Look for me.
There's books like Zag by Marty Neumeier, which is a book on strategy.
[1:04:34] That's amazing. Logo modernism that's liken inspire inspirational book.
Yeah, Science Books is well, I have a lot of Richard Dawkins books, but, uh, so that's a whole different area that we could speak about.
[1:04:50] Is there an artist or a piece of art that has influenced you the most community where talking about the type of work that I do I like toe have benchmark work.
So there are agencies like Pentagram. So Michael Beirut, I'm always looking at their work and being inspired by that. And people like Sagi Haviv.
They're all logo designers. It is easy to look at our logo and think it's just something really simple that.
[1:05:17] As I said about this conversation earlier, there are companies that was spend millions of pounds on a logo and allow.
These things are documented in books, and you have to kind of embody all of what that business stands for in one symbol.
And I have always found it fascinating. And this companies like Pentagram and Sagi Haviv and guys more and have ive he he works with this.
This I find it really inspiring. What they're doing is so simple, but there's so much to it.
And that's the type of work that I'm constantly looking at, and I aspire to create if I can, Where can people find you if they want to learn more about what you're doing? Just searching leg a geek.
I'm so happy every on every single platform. It used to be different.
There's another story to this which I can say for another day, but I am at logo geek as one word on every platform now.
So do search Google for Logo Geek or on your preferred social media platform. I should be Loga geek on there as well.
Well in man. Thank you so much for being on the show. I know it's a little bit later there for you in England, but man, this has been an absolute treat.
Has been fun. I hope it's being useful for listeners, hopefully is being or value to anyone that's been watching this.
[1:06:42] Music.
[1:06:50] That's it for this episode, whether this is your first time listening or you're already a fan. Thanks for being here. I hope you enjoy the show.
All links and show notes for this episode can be found at the artful dot co slash podcast.
[1:07:05] If you haven't yet, please subscribe to the show and leave it rating a review on iTunes. Spotify Wherever you listen about guests, if you like what you hear on, want to be a guest or know someone that's a good fit?
Go to the artful dot co slash guest, and if you want to leave me a note about an idea or topic for the show, go to the artful dot co slash speak pipe. Thanks again for listening until next time.
[1:07:29] Music.
